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Post by triffid on Nov 15, 2011 20:05:26 GMT
I am not a welder or owt but I'm not sure you will be able to put the wedge bit in very easily. You are trying to bend an almost right angled bit of metal and you will also have the resistance from the legshields too you will be trying to force them apart too.
How does this sound to folks - make a cut at the back of the tunnel and about 3/4 of the way to the front. Remove the top piece of the tunnel at the back end where it would go into the frame and also from the top bit of the front of the tunnel so that you can slide the tunnel back into the rear of the frame and the front of the frame into the tunnel without lowering it under the piece it will be sliding under.
Weld up the newly positioned pieces inside and out and lead fill to get a smooth finish along the length of your new tunnel.
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Post by allsorts on Nov 15, 2011 20:27:51 GMT
Thanks for the reply Triffid, but I am having difficulty grasping your concept. I'm not criticising, because I acknowledge that these changes are difficult to describe: if we were standing in the same workshop with a frame at our feet, I am sure I would be with your straight away.
Can you try and elaborate, as I am keen to find the easiest way?
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Post by triffid on Nov 15, 2011 20:36:35 GMT
Okay, if you cut the tunnel in the middle and moved the front part back into the rear part as someone suggested similar earlier you would have the front part underneath the rear part, altering the floor line of the scoot. If you cut the top piece off the tunnel you can slide the section backward and keep the top of the tunnel in line. If you make a couple of cuts this way you may be able to do it so that on part slips back into another enough just to keep the side walls of the tunnel touching, then weld all round inside and out. You will still have a lip on the outside where on piece has slipped back into the other but the top should be level and then you can smooth and lead fill the side walls to make it all look trim and proper. If you ar eworried about strength you could perhaps weld a rod down the length of the tunnell on the inside at the right angles and maybe along the bottom edges. Hope this explains a bit better. As I say I'm no expert and may be speaking bollocks Mr Sugarlump, any advice?
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Post by ss152 on Nov 15, 2011 22:02:46 GMT
...interesting stuff...so what is the official actual measurement from top of frame to seat base on a ss50/90
...also aren't all the small frame sections been reproduced...?
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Post by allsorts on Nov 15, 2011 23:19:20 GMT
Thanks Triffid, but I think that there are less welds other proposals in this thread. Not all the parts are re-produced. The left hand side panel isn't made and some of the other parts are quite expensive; so much so that you feel that that buying them in just to cut them up is a bit of a waste (well not a waste, but an expensive risk). I need a measurement too. I want to know the distance from the horn of the seat to the point on the inside of the legshields, parallel with the floor (on the centre line) for an SS90. This is effectively the line of the underside of the dummy tank. Can you pop out and measure the red one for me Tony?
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Post by pedro10012000 on Nov 16, 2011 0:13:47 GMT
386mm from the front of the seam on the seat horn to the inside of the legshield tunnel, measured dead horizontal with the scoot on its tires (not on the stand).
N/b the tunnel slopes quite a bit at that point, so if the frame is even a fraction from horizontal (eg due to tire pressures, suspension lift) will throw the measurement out by a few mm. You may be better to take the measure from the top of the tunnel (just below the headset) to the radius at the top front of the seat horn - mine measures 360mm at that point.
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Post by tony on Nov 16, 2011 0:46:57 GMT
i think the thing to do is tank off seat,dummy tank and fuel tank. get a length of rigid steel that doesnt flex. Drill and bolt to rear seat mount.. and to the dummy tank mounts too with the length of it touching the frame at the front.. mark up and use this as your guide on the new frame. Allsorts I dont mind if you wanna come and do this.
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Post by allsorts on Nov 16, 2011 18:16:14 GMT
Thanks Pedro. Tony, that's a pretty neat idea; using the front and back mounts for the seat as a mount for the bracket that will keep the frame straight during the shortening process. I am still thinking that my sliding-brace idea on page one is still the way to go, but I have revised my idea for narrowing the centre tunnel. Whilst I thought of cutting a V into the front of the tunnel to widen it (as it turns up the legshields), I now think it would be better to cut a V into the horizontal (top) of the tunnel and narrow it. This will help maintain the line where the flange on the bottom of the tunnel meets the floor pan. Anyway, I should have the final piece of the jigsaw this weekend. I will then have the Spanish frame, the repro floor pan, a brand new RHS of the back end and a rather tired full back-end from a V50. Then, and only then, will the angle grinder be fired up to prep the parts.
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Post by allsorts on Nov 23, 2011 23:45:51 GMT
An update. Tonight I started the conversion. Taking my previous idea, and the suggestion from Tony, I obtained two box-sections of steel and mounted them on a bolt-on fixing where the seat attaches. This is parallel to the floor. The allen bolts A and B are drilled and tapped at 45 degrees to take up the slop between the two box sections. Inserting them at 45 degrees ensures the internal box is always pushed into the same corner. Continuity is important if the two halves are to be reconnected straight. The bracket is high enough to allow the spare to sit-in the frame. Whilst the wheel is not the critical measurement here, it does represent the look I am after by closing up the centre section of the frame. The bolt on bracket is much better than my idea, as the half the bracket can be unbolted to allow the two halves to be fully separated and re-built with greater flexibility. Nice.
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Post by allsorts on Nov 24, 2011 0:00:11 GMT
Now the floor. Working from underneath, I used a 7mm drill to drill out as many spot welds as possible. The rusty floor gave way rather too easily in a few places, leaving excess holes on the tunnel flange. Never mind, these will weld-up. A lot of rust fell out of the tunnel, but when the floor was finally off, most of the rust had come from the inside of the floor, which is not an issue at all. Next, I need to cut the tunnel to allow the frame to be shortened. The next installment may come at the weekend.
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Post by ttscshaggy on Nov 24, 2011 0:27:54 GMT
Nice work mate
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Post by Spanish Rob on Nov 24, 2011 2:26:18 GMT
Wow great work. Someone trying to turn a sows ear into a silk purse while elsewhere there's another fellah doing the opposite (apparently)
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Post by allsorts on Nov 25, 2011 21:21:23 GMT
Nice words Bob, but the silk purse is yet to be produced (unless you meant that I was making a pig's ear of it) Stay tuned folks.
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Post by nicsar on Nov 25, 2011 22:07:40 GMT
Looking good! That has been a nice colour, is it verde mela?
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Post by allsorts on Nov 25, 2011 22:55:25 GMT
Verde would make me think of green, but this scooter was yellow.
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Post by nicsar on Nov 25, 2011 23:13:23 GMT
yellow but a bit on the green side. Google is my friend, yours is definately more yellow..
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Post by Spanish Rob on Nov 26, 2011 3:27:25 GMT
I wasn't just being charitable. Takes guts to do and so gets the from me! Whatever happens it's not like your taking a barnfindgem and pouring tar and feathers on it eh? I do wonder if one slide box section is enough to stop any movement of a twisting L/R nature. There is term for that in aeronautics perhaps someone can enlighten me but for I'm going to stick with twisting l/r around a vertical if that makes sense??? Meantime though that's got to be mustard yellow isn't it?
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Post by allsorts on Nov 27, 2011 15:44:27 GMT
Ta Bob. The tool box is in the post, BTW. Now I have looked at the yellow again, I can see that it is the original colour. Much of the frame was blasted, and I wrongly assumed that the yellow was not the original colour. In fact, I thought that the yellow under the panels was over-spray. Now I have removed the floor, I have screwed a 600 x 600 sheet of MDF to be bottom of the scooter. I can draw datum lines on the MDF the ensure that I don't go off line. I have marked the cut with 40mm wide strip of masking tape. I hope that this will allow me to cut the tunnel. After I finish typing this, I''ll be reaching for the hacksaw. (Actually, I oversprayed the masking tape with a tin of spray paint, then removed the tape to leave a clear line for the cut)
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Post by allsorts on Nov 28, 2011 23:32:16 GMT
I have made the cut. 40mm seems like a lot, but you can see the difference in these before and after photos. In the second photo, you can see how the spare wheel fits tight between the seat horn and the bottom of the inside of the steering column (thanks for that measurement Pedro). Compare this with the photo below where the gap at location A is very evident. The next task is to re-shape the tunnel and tack it prior to welding by a grown-up.
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Post by amazombi on Nov 29, 2011 5:19:36 GMT
The step is nowhere near as bad as I'd imagined. That shouldn't be to difficult to finish. Well done.
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