ignitions, which ones

[jonnysnatchsniffer]

so.... after frying my brain for a few years and am out of touch with all the new shit that we have to choose from
so pros and cons, whats going on in the world of making sparks and lights
lookin for a 1kg max weight, with advance/retard, no battery needed but would like to use an ac rev counter/speedo probably the sip item
and need lighting so i can go out to play at night

[henri]

its 1390g , but the sip vapes good , also need a KOSO rev counter filter doohickey for your rev counter to work .the advantage over the 4 pole systems is 8 lighting coils .so no more dim lights an speedo dropping out at tickover .H

[oldscooterbloke]

Agree with Henri have used 3 vapes myself. good bit of kit bloody good lights. and two piece flywheel. all good

[jonnysnatchsniffer]

i dont need bright lights, i rode lammmy chops from 17 to 35 and couldnt ever see a fucking thing unless it was in the tops of trees, so i dont find
the vespatronic all that bad as with the low weight i need a higher tickover, i never use the horn, and i dont need an mot
all i need is is 0.8-1kg flywheel without the fan as i have the vespatronic one, ive looked the stator over and it looks ok
how the fuck do these things work?

[tzsteve]

They work by magic......
Powerful white mans magic.

Im using a VMC kit much like the polini vespatronic etc.
No problems

I understand you looking for a 1kg flywheel ?
, would the extra 300-400grams really make all that difference

I set my kit up for DC using a200 watt LC regulator and use a daytona veluna speedo rev counter ( i dont like the koso stuff)

[jonnysnatchsniffer]

can that same magic rebuild my motor by the time i go to strip it tomorrow, i need theese fairys or whatever they are
yeah 300-400g makes a big difference especially when it comes on pipe, tho its not all about the weight its where the weight is, further out is bad, not bad for every one but for quite a peaky thing like mine which has already twisted the crank, the less the better, i used to just take the flywheel off lammys and run it battery just off the points boss
had to pull away at 4000rpm but made it fun, could have added disc to the boss but just wanted to see what its like
as it was with the 1kg wheel and hartz clutch it did make launching a bit problematic as the xxxl springs made the genuine honda plates a bit grabby, i think lth or whoever made the clutch has plates to combat this, id prefer 800g tbh

[tzsteve]

It sounds like its time to look at an internal rotor,
There must be something like a motorplat etc that you could bodge to fit,
Sprinting and racing are fun but far too expensive for my pockets the none stop search for the last 1/2 bhp and the constant battle for increased reliability would drive me nuts

[henri]

google "horsepower ignitions" they do internal rotor ignitions ,but from what ive seen none have lighting coils .H

[jonnysnatchsniffer]

this is for my road scooter which is just a little toy like any extensively tuned smallframe, so will need lights,, just not bothered about great lights
chisel speed quoted me 170 quids for the wheel without the fan lol
so this parma one seems more like my end of the price scale, so will this wheel work with my stator?
www.10pollici.com/en/homepage/classic-vespa/engine/ignitions-and-flywheels/parmakit/flywheel-parmakit-cone-20-kg-0-9-vespa-special-et3-primavera-pk.2.1.122.gp.2138.uw

[tzsteve]

Looks like my vmc one

[jonnysnatchsniffer]

when i google the wheel i want it says its suitable for every 20mm taper from the pkxl to the px lusso, do these wheels have twin keyways? id rather not have 2 keyways as its more
likely to shit a key as there isnt as much surface area on the taper, or is it magic and they just work with the correct stator position per specific model
it would make sense that way

[henri]

as there dual spark/wasted spark ignition types the same flys work on both types of engines . the keyways on dual key flys are about 140degs apart ,the ignitions fire every 180degs . so a bit of jiggery pokery on stator mounting plates an same stators an flys run both smalls n larges .H

[tzsteve]

Just a little thing nobody mentions ,
If you assume the spark is at tdc and bdc swapping the ignition wires will cause it to fire at 90 before and after tdc so these can be very easily adapted to your needs

Yes i know we dont fire at tdc but you get my drift

[jonnysnatchsniffer]

OK so this is fun
Not
Got a vmc flywheel with a vespatronic stator and cdi
So put the stator in its place as per the vespatronic, it ran like shit and would only rev to about 6000rpm so couldn't get on the pipe,just boggy, missing and backfires, so upon inspection the keyway is about 20 degrees different on the vmc so adjusted the stator accordingly, but what is that? I know it's the magnets that decide when it fires, but is it the leading or trailing edge that determines that?
Anyway it ran somewhat better with a bit more advance, then as some had suggested swapping the wires on the cdi, then it fired up sweet as a nut and revved out, so off I go push it out onto the street and once warmed up a bit put it in 1st give it a bit and end up going backwards into the front garden
What a cunt, wires back as they should a little more advance but still not right, all the vmc stator fitted looks like the the ht coil is at 8 o'clock ish, yet on the vespatronic it's at 2 o'clock, I think my stator may have to be turned 180 on the backplate to get more advance, I dunno, never usually have problems as I've always had spares for the standard ignition

[jonnysnatchsniffer]

ok so ive found a problem with the vmc wheel with compatiblity, the vmc boss is a weedy item compared to the vespatronic and sits the wheel 1.5mm further out so the magnets
arnt in the right place, ive had this problem with the ducati ignitiongs when doing conversios etc
also the stator backplate isnt a snug fit into the indents on the flycase, usually its a tight fit but i have witnes marks on new wheel cos the stator doesnt fit in tight,
like you normally have to tap it in, ive got 0.7 mm clearance so thats how much the stator backplate can move from up down left right its the same in all the cases that are pk but good on the vma1 case.
what the fuck is all that about, that could hav been why the crank twisted after a mag hit the stator
who makes the vespatronic? cos this is not fucking right on a 350 quid bit of equipment, cunts, im all revved up unlike my scooter grrrrrr
fly touches laminates so wil missfire
more importanly how the fuck am i gonna centre it? had same problem with pk lammy conversions but a bit of shave on the hall sensor pickup sorted that

[jonnysnatchsniffer]

and today ive looked at the new vmc flywheel and the are cracks in 2 of the magnets meaning the one magnet now has 2 north and south poles which
isnt good for spark timing, this probably happened befor i centred it
strange thing is is that this ignition has been trouble free on 4 different cases
took reed valve off and the boyesen dual stage had abou 1mm lift in the outer edges, so that wont help off the pipe
ive put thicker reeds on the bottom as they chip easy on the corners for some reason

[henri]

only troubles ive had with vmc stators ,well the base plates. is on some cases the centre boss around crank seal interferes with the base plate sitting down flush .so out with belt sander an have to relieve the baseplate .H