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Post by willspeed on Dec 4, 2010 18:13:28 GMT
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Post by Juan on Dec 4, 2010 18:19:02 GMT
I doubt it's made by Beedspeed, made for them more like or they're just buying it in from the supplier.
It's a copy of the Franz as made by Ludwig & Scherer (Amazombi) and I'd be guessing but I'd imagine it comes from the far East most likely.
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Post by scooteristforever on Dec 4, 2010 18:55:46 GMT
surely got to be made with cheaper labour from overseas at that price.....
quality may well be sub standard to the real deal, but then if the price difference sways it, people will buy them......
ALL exhausts are always going to break at some point in time,
I think its a fine line between performance and durability....
whats the difference in price between this one and the Real Deal, anybody know...
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Post by Juan on Dec 4, 2010 19:08:36 GMT
Genuine Franz comes in around £300 I think. Don't know it compairs back to back but copies tend to be not as good. Look at ScootRS or Sterling copies of the PM Tuning systems. Work okay to a degree but personally I'd pay the extra coin for a genuine system. That and the fact theiy're ripping off someone else's hard work.  |
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Post by scooteristforever on Dec 4, 2010 19:58:57 GMT
if it is virtually half the price of the FRANZ, then people will buy them, but then they may only be getting half the exhaust for their money....  on the topic of a rip off, i know it must be annoying for a manufacturer so see their product being copied (and sold cheaper) especialy when its them thats done all the hard work regarding research, developement and testing, But some will say ANYBODY`S fair game to be copied, surely as long as an item isnt being passed off as the the real thing ( counterfeited) then competition is healthy...!!! PM tuning appear to have a serious gripe with NK Exhausts, but funnily enough if PM Tuning hadnt had supply and demand issues and an appauling aftersales non exsistant warranty policy, the likes of A.F Rayspeed wouldnt have had the need to go else where to find a manufacturer for literally 1000`s of TS1 exhaust systems......... this was at a time when many scooterists took a local scooter dealers word as gospel.. I.E "they recommend, i buy without question" if my car needs say £100 - £150 quids worth of exhaust for its M.O.T i moan and complain for days... if my scooter needs £200 quids worth of exhaust i buy it like a shot no questions.... and i know which one lasts the longest, by some way....  |
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Post by hank on Dec 5, 2010 14:02:40 GMT
it looks pretty good and I'm sure at that price, it will sell. its got to be better than the other exhaust choices at beedspeed................!
i guess its the same as buying non genuine parts for cars, the manufacturers ones are always gonna last longer and be bettter quality but at a price, you pay your money and take your chance.
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Post by amazombi on Dec 9, 2010 23:47:30 GMT
The one pictured there is not an original Franz. It's a copy made in Vietnam.The pipe has been tested back to back against a Franz. It looses about 1,5 BHP on an 18 BHP engine. There is an article about that in Classic-Scooter Magazine. I had a look at the pipe, and they made two mistakes making the copy. I wasn't tempted to contact the geezer behind the copies (bloke from Germany) to tell him the details though.
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Post by 150sportique on Dec 10, 2010 18:07:18 GMT
I'm confused. Is it the black one that's the copy?
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Post by amazombi on Dec 10, 2010 19:20:09 GMT
The black one sold by Beedspeed is a copy of a copy. I think it's imported and sold by a company in Italy. The chromed one you bought is the first copy, sold by a German company and made in Vietnam. From what I see on the pictures they both deviate from the original in two points at least, plus one minor detail. That detail is actually intended to improve the pipe by supporting the muffler with some sheet metal. I had a bracket on the first batch I made, but then decided it wasn't needed, so I left it out. Adding that sheet thing is of no consquence for the performance though. The other two details do change performance so.
The HZ is a Vietnamese Copy again sold by that German bloke. It's based on the the first batch that was made, the second batch has a different segmentation of the baffle cones.
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Post by scooteristforever on Dec 10, 2010 19:49:20 GMT
so are we talking a SNIDE SNIDEY pipe.... if enough people copy them, they might come down to £29.99 in price..  |
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Post by 150sportique on Dec 10, 2010 20:35:30 GMT
Thanks amazombi, I've removed my post just so as not to confuse people.
It gets pretty confusing when a copy gets copied.
Do you know of any problems with my copies, so I can get bracing/changes made before I put them on?
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Post by amazombi on Dec 10, 2010 21:03:52 GMT
I actually think the build quality is pretty good. I don't think it will fall apart or anything like that. They didn't use 0.8mm gauge sheet metal like the Italians often do either, it's got quite a substantial feeling to it.
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Post by stusclues on Dec 20, 2010 11:41:00 GMT
If these are viet ones I would say they are the same as the ones on the saigon scooter website. www.saigonscootercentre.com/ProductDetail.asp?idBasket=&idcat=&itemid=3769&p=145&c_id=&s_id=The guy that owns saigon scoots is a mate of mine (he came over to australia for the lammy 60th weekend we had in sydney) so I will shoot him an email and ask him what the deal with em is. From my experience with his stuff it is usually pretty well made, but I spose he can only copy what he gets... I am actually thinking of getting one of em to try on my M1l so I will do a report when I get off my arse and actually compare it to what I have on mine already. |
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Post by firej on Dec 25, 2010 5:20:47 GMT
its a cheapO steel one that comes from the NAM I just saw one on a bike a guy had just got from Saigon it was already rust but thats what happens if you live on the beach in Florida...
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Post by spiderwebb on May 20, 2011 1:18:34 GMT
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Post by charliec on May 20, 2011 20:31:29 GMT
wooahhh!!! (bradford mode on ) Thats Bad Boy!!! ( bradford mode off) holey moley that looks good |
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