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Post by gugne on Sept 28, 2022 15:36:27 GMT
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Post by gentile on Sept 28, 2022 16:30:53 GMT
Ok thanks a lot that makes sense. I could have sworn it was the manifold twisting with the carb as I rotated it but thinking about your response makes sense. Which I guess would mean the clamp isn't doing its job or there is play in the sleeve....
I'll have another look this evening.
Thanks everyone for the help I really appreciate it.
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Post by jbcollier on Sept 29, 2022 12:01:29 GMT
If the fasteners are not tight, then the manifold can twist somewhat. If it is twisting, it may have damaged the gasket. Don't just tighten it up. Take it apart and inspect.
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Post by gentile on Sept 29, 2022 18:25:15 GMT
Do you have to drop the engine to take it apart on can you check from the carb side?
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Post by jbcollier on Sept 30, 2022 14:46:28 GMT
Remove the carb and undo the lower rear shock bolt and nut. Now the engine can swing down and you can easily remove the cylinder cowl to get at the manifold fittings.
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Post by gentile on Sept 30, 2022 18:03:41 GMT
Fantastic thanks so much, really appreciate it.
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Post by oldscooterbloke on Oct 1, 2022 21:49:01 GMT
Maybe it's just that the manifold is a two part affair, the loose alloy bit has a slight movement should stop almost sure once the carb clamp is tight.if it seals and doesn't run on fast when returning back to idle, then its ok. Needs the soft fibre washer in there, as a leak is bad as it's lean.
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Post by oldscooterbloke on Oct 1, 2022 21:53:29 GMT
Buy a new cap. to be certain.
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Post by jbcollier on Oct 2, 2022 12:17:06 GMT
The business part of the intake manifold is one piece. One end bolts to the engine case and the carb slides over the other end. The aluminium bit is a seat for the carb/body bellows and part of the clamp for the carb. The felt seal is to keep the dust and water of the rear wheel well out of the centre of the scoot frame. This allows the carb to draw clean air and helps prevent body corrosion. The felt seal is useful but not required.
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Post by gentile on Oct 2, 2022 18:37:38 GMT
Thanks everyone. I made sure I ordered a couple of the felt rings when I cleaned the carb so I placed a greased up one in before putting the cleaned carb back on.
I tried to drill a hole in the cap (without taking it off) and there was a lot of mesh that came out the other side of the cap that won't come out. It feels pretty blocked still so think I need to order a. Rand new fuel cap to be safe.
Will post an update as soon as it's arrived and on/tested.
Thanks again for all your help.
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Post by tzsteve on Oct 7, 2022 9:23:51 GMT
All that mesh acts as an air filter for the air entering the fuel tank.
I have a hunch that there may be a one way valve in there to stop fuel leaking when the scoot is on its side. But i may be wrong
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Post by gentile on Oct 15, 2022 10:01:41 GMT
Massive thank you to everyone who helped on this thread.
After cleaning the carb, cleaning the tank, and then taking it out with the fuel cap off it ran perfectly. No stuttering or boging after five/tens of riding like before.
I tried to drill a hole in the existing fuel cap but there was a lot of mesh in there so i decided to order a new fuel tap from SIP.
I put the fuel cap on last night. That was a pain to get it on as the rubber was obviously new too so the fuel latch didn't quite reach over as the rubber needs to bed in. I got it on in the end.
Took the bike out for a ride down to the sea this morning.
No bogging, no hesitation through any of the gears. I have a it a good run and a bit of a ringing to test it and all my problems appear to have vanished. 😃
Now I'm waiting for someone to ask why I bothered to clean the carb and tank when all I needed was a new fuel cap.....🤣
Thanks again for all your help. I can't tell you how happy I am to be back on the road.
Cheers Gentile
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hrvespa
ETS
1981 50 special, 1977 primavera, 1964 GL 150, 1975 125 TS (early P200 engine)
Posts: 164
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Post by hrvespa on Oct 19, 2022 12:57:16 GMT
Now I'm waiting for someone to ask why I bothered to clean the carb and tank when all I needed was a new fuel cap.....🤣. Cheers Gentile Just call it a pre-emptive winter maintenance schedule!
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Post by gentile on Oct 21, 2022 13:11:00 GMT
🤣
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Post by gentile on Oct 29, 2022 12:26:43 GMT
.....back to the drawing board. :-(
I went for a ride this morning and after five minutes the same symptoms presented themselves. The bike lost power in 4th and as I change down to try and find some power I could wind the throttle in 3rd and hear the engine but there was not enough power to keep going.
I rolled to the side of the road and bike wanted to stall. A bit of choke and all things were fine. Choke in, pulled away fine in 1st 2nd 3rs to 4th. Rode for another five minutes then the symptoms appeared again.
It's like you roll the throttle, the bike feels like is misfiring trying to accelerate without power then it finds a bit for a while then back to the symptoms. Really odd.
I managed to get home as the bike doesn't die it just becomes lethargic, powerless in places.
Do all routes now point to the ignition?
I'm thinking it's time to get it booked in so if there is anyone with availablity on the south coast (Henri maybe?) I'd be keen to book it in to have it looked at by someone who knows what they're doing. I think this a problem that i'm not solving with my limited mechanic skills.
Cheers G
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Post by jbcollier on Oct 29, 2022 13:28:26 GMT
Back in the day we would get calls from people with 70s Chryslers reporting their car had just stalled. We would tell them to change the left rear tire. They would phone back, shocked, and report it had worked, their car was running again. Of course we then told them to bring it in. What was going on? A transistor in the ignition control unit was overheating. The time taken to change the tire allowed it to cool down. I think it's time to look at your ignition.
What type of ignition do you have?
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Post by gentile on Oct 29, 2022 13:38:03 GMT
I have no idea what type of ignition is in the bike. That shows you how ignorant I am when it comes to Vespa maintenance.😔
Early on in the thread when I described the symptoms Henri commented that it sounded ignition related, something like a failing LT coil or pick up on the stator/dodgy cdi or connections on it.
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Post by gentile on Oct 31, 2022 7:00:47 GMT
Found this thread on Vespa.org forums. Although it relates to 200, the symptoms are exactly the same as I've been facing. The advice early on in this thread was towards it being a compression issue with the clutch side oil seal. My Vespa started dropping oil just before these symptoms started and Henri mentioned that this could be the cause of the issue when I first put up a post at the start of the year. I changed the gear oil nuts with new ones and filled up the gear oil but when I drained it when rebuilding the carb and putting a new fuel cap on there was literally nothing in the bike which seemed odd. I tuned the carb myself could my symptoms still be happening because I've not tuned it properly and it's running too rich? vespa.proboards.com/thread/4375/p200e-cuts-when-throttle-opened?page=1
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Post by jbcollier on Oct 31, 2022 11:25:15 GMT
Yes, if your scoot is snorting gear oil, it could be the issue.
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Post by gentile on Oct 31, 2022 14:21:02 GMT
Ok thank you. Is it worth trying to adjust the air/fuel mix in case it is running too rich?
Can running too rich generate these symptoms too?
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