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Post by darrenc on Jun 6, 2020 10:10:08 GMT
The PK stator I have has the shielding rubbing off the wires, that go through the stator plate, so I'll be replacing those with 18g wires. But I want to prevent this from happening again. What have you done to prevent this kind of thing?
Cheers
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Post by jbcollier on Jun 6, 2020 14:25:07 GMT
The wires are exposed to heat, vibration, and sometimes oil and gas. It's hardly surprising that 30 or 40 years later there would be problems.
I'd use 16g wire myself. Use good quality, pliable, automotive wire from a reputable supplier. Autosparks is who I use. Don't use the wire sold in most hardware/auto parts stores. It's stiff and poor quality.
Route the wires carefully, protect them with sheathing, and support them where possible to reduce vibration.
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Post by tzsteve on Jun 6, 2020 16:39:23 GMT
I think you are on about the multi strand wire that comes from the stator and not the stuff on the bobbins
I use 32 strand 0.2 MM. Tin plated wire, this is what I have found the best the strands are thin enough to be nice and flexible the tin coating prevents the copper rotting this wire will easily handle about 10amps
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Post by darrenc on Jun 7, 2020 3:34:03 GMT
The wiring that had dead shielding was fairly new. I would have expected 40 year old to be very gone. I was considering some hot glue or some foam around the bundle that just goes through the stator plate.
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Post by jbcollier on Jun 7, 2020 4:44:33 GMT
Good wire, protected and supported, lasts. Crap wire, not so much.
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Post by darrenc on Jun 7, 2020 7:13:53 GMT
A lot of the diagrams I've seen for a vespa 100 sport have a yellow wire on the diagram. JB, I know you've helped a lot to everyone on this matter, even me in the past. Since I've been out of the Vespa mindset for a while I had to relearn some things. So I've been looking at my system and making diagrams down for my 100 sport with indicators, battery and regulator The 5 wire stator: black to ground, battery neg and regulator Blue goes to the violet to the regulatorRed, green, white goes to the Ducati CDI, which grounds to the frame The green from the stator goes to the junction for the kill switch. Regulator Black comes from the stator and is grounded to the frame and neg on the battery Grey goes to the indicator relay Red goes to the fused wire to the positive Violet 1 goes to the blue of the stator Violet 2 goes to the headset What I don't get is the yellow wire on this www.scooterhelp.com/electrics/wiring/V9B1T.sport.pdfI found this diagram someone had made that swapped out the points stator and coil, to the electronic one modernvespa.com/forum/topic117698If we ignore the yellow wire am I doing it right as described above? I do have a Ducati regulator that has the AA +B ground and G or (red red grey black yellow) sitting in my parts bin Thank you
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Post by jbcollier on Jun 7, 2020 15:17:44 GMT
The 100 sport, along with the North American P200, has two separate charging systems. The regulator has separate AC and DC units built into one box. The AC side feeds only the headlight while the DC side, aided by the battery, runs everything else. That way you get bright tail, brake and indicator lights, and a loud horn, even at an idle. The DC side is fully isolated so it can be hooked directly to the battery without drawing it down. The regulator controls the ground side for rectification and regulation. The red and yellow wires are the two outputs from the isolated coils.
Now, are you fitting a PK stator to a 100 Sport?
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Post by darrenc on Jun 7, 2020 23:08:25 GMT
After looking at so many wires, two different stators and working on night shifts my brain is fried and I'm partially stupid.
The current stator on it, has the standard RED, WHITE, GREEN that are plugged into the CDI, and I think the other GREEN lead on the CDI goes to the kill switch.
The other set of wires from the stator are BLACK, BLUE, and GREEN. All of these ones go to the junction box as they have leads that screw into the box. Now part of me is now thinking that the green wire should be YELLOW. If I run indicators, with a battery what rectifier do I need? Presently in the scooter I was running before it had a PURPLE, PURPLE, RED, GREY, BLACK setup for wiring. Red to the Violet in, Violet out, Red to Battery, Grey to indicator relay, and Black was in and then grounded as well.
I also have a YELLOW, GREEN, BLACK rectifier as well as an A A B+ Ground Y.
Sorry for the confusion, and thanks for your yelp
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Post by jbcollier on Jun 8, 2020 15:57:14 GMT
You're right. It's getting confusing. Let's just talk about one part at a time.
First up, the stator.
Yes, the red/green/white combo go to the CDi.
Yes, the second green terminal on the CDi is for the kill switch.
However, sometimes the kill connection is made at the stator. So the green wire in your second set from the stator may be kill as well. Please look carefully at the stator and see where each green wire goes.
The two greens join together at the ignition primary coil? Great, we can forget about it and we know what the blue and black are for so we can move on.
The two greens don't join. Your stator has the pick up and next to it the primary ignition coil (immediately counter-clockwise to the pick-up) where one of the green wires go. That leaves four other coils. How are they wired up? Look at the diagrams at scooter help.com so you know what I mean.
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Post by darrenc on Jun 9, 2020 0:54:12 GMT
The two green wires are connected at the same point. So that tells me that the green wire should go to the kill switch. Blue is power of the coils, and black is grounded. From all the stators online that I can find, it looks like this one but as you said earlier, the green wire is hooked up with the green that goes to the CDI beedspeed.com/collections/vespa-flywheels-stators/products/vespa-stator-plate-pk-pkxl-ets-genuine-piaggio-converted-for-prim-elecWould you suggest this wiring diagram www.scooterhelp.com/electrics/wiring/PK_6V_6pole_no_batt_or_ind.pdfEven though my headset has switches on both sides, I can ignore them but I can still use the kill switch, hi/low and horn. I will also find a 12v regulator and have the blue go into that, and split it off to the headlight, brake and rear lights. I also have another headset that needs some prep and restore in order to fit, its only got switches on the right side. I looked through some of the hybrid ones as well, none of them fit.
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Post by jbcollier on Jun 9, 2020 13:14:01 GMT
Good! Stator down.
Now, what scoot is this? A 100 Sport?
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Post by darrenc on Jun 9, 2020 18:27:30 GMT
I have a 100 sport frame yes, and a a 1972 V90. The 100 sport is complete although needs a new battery. The V90 needs a variety of parts including a new paint job.
As much as indicators are fun and bright, they are annoying when it comes to wiring. I'm really tempted to get on the road this summer to ignore signals in the 100 sport, skip the battery and go that route for now.
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Post by jbcollier on Jun 10, 2020 4:52:04 GMT
Everything will work off AC except the DC horn and the flasher relay. Change the horn, disconnect the flasher and you'll be fine. Use a simple AC regulator, or just the AC part of the stock reg (A A & ground).
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Post by darrenc on Jun 10, 2020 7:59:50 GMT
Awesome, thanks so much
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Post by darrenc on Jun 11, 2020 19:11:01 GMT
I decided to uninstall the indicators, and ignore the battery (because the old one is dead anyway).
So I'll just make a harness using the green wire for the key on the headset, but I might wire in the kill switch as well because I find its good to have.
Because I like wiring diagram to follow what diagram do you suggest I create.
No battery or indicators, no brake switch on the head set. It will have a horn.
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Post by jbcollier on Jun 12, 2020 2:40:25 GMT
This is a 12v AC harness with signals and other stuff you don't want. Just edit them out.
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Post by darrenc on Jun 12, 2020 18:44:45 GMT
This diagram is what I needed, thanks. Which scooter is this one?
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Post by jbcollier on Jun 12, 2020 20:14:43 GMT
PK125S I think.
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Post by darrenc on Jun 15, 2020 11:02:24 GMT
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