Motovespa RB22 scarerer

[motovespa]

Hi there,

I've just picked up a nice 125 Super in pieces and I'm planning to turn it into a bit of a street racer/sleeper, I'm not after mental power just enough to scare the RB22 boys that their Lambrettas are not the be all and end all......anyway....

I want to try and keep everything mostly standard looking as possible, and fairly reliable so I can use it to get to work on etc... I don't want to cut the frame and it would be good to keep the carb in the normal place etc.

I'm no expert with engine tuning but I know enough to get by and can normally figure things out to make them work!

So I guess I'm looking to get between 16hp-20hp-ish, does anyone have any suggestions for a barrel? Would the humble Polini 130 be up for this or would a newer Parma type kit be better in the long run? Probably want to keep it rotary valve for now until I get a bit more confident to do a reed valve

I was thnking maybe Hammerzombie exhaust (do these just bolt on or do I need to modify the suspension?)
parma/vespatronic ignition
Super clutch

Does that sound like a good start?

Any advice is appreciated!

Cheers,
Motovespa

[tony]

hi mate, you'll have to be prepared to do a lot of work to get a rotary up to 20bhp. the current cylinder which i would say possibly could touch it is the quattrini m1.
The reed M1r race kit with special crank and pipe only (i say only but its actually quite mad) reaches 24bhp out of the box when run on a dyno that doesnt exaggerate.
I would say the best way to easy power is indeed go the reed route and my choice for the road would be the Falc followed by the Quattrini M1L.

[hank]

yeah, but that's gonna cost him about £10,000, tony ;D


ok, maybe, not that much, £1,200 to £1,500?

[motovespa]

And am I right in thinking once I've gone reed I can never go back? I'd just feel guilty destroying perfectly good engine casings.

Ok, maybe I need to lower my expectations.

To give the RB22 boys a little fright how much HP do you think is reasonable to do this? 16-20HP was pretty much just a random number made up by me.

[tony]

16 to 20 is race spec group 4 power in a vespa mate.. my one had 18.5 out of my rotary 135 malossi.. 22.4 out of a rotary fabrizi.. but this took a lot of work,trick cranks, mappable ign. and then getiing a pipe made to work with it all.
To go reed you dont destroy the casings with an m1l. The reed is on the barrel.
yeah mr hank is right this stuff is expensive but its goooooood! ;D

[motovespa]

But even with the reed on the barrel would that not mean I'd have to weld up the carb inlet destroying the rotary pad?

This is going to be a bit of a long term project so money isn't an issue for now so the expensive falc/parma gear are options but I'm still not interested in creating some uncontrollable monster, I'd rather have reliability and only have to build it once without having to constantly change clutch plates and piston rings etc...

Thanks for the advice so far,

So what's the rotary M1 like out of the box?

[tony]

no weld reqd.. you could just make a plate to cover the old inlet hole.. really you wouldnt even need to fill it with anything. I used devcon on the one i just did, plate over the top for good measure.
After seeing how nice these kits are i wouldn't mind one myself.

[hank]

smallyshane's running a new rotary M1 kit in with 24mm carb & polini evo pipe (i think?), which replaced his polini. He might add his comments to this thread when he sees it, he's the best to comment, but its certainly more powerful than the std polini or malossi.

sugarlump's getting 14 bhp from Ad's old "worked"malossi/reed combo, so theres still life in the old dogs.

[motovespa]

Ah ok, a plate or whatever will do the job then!

With the reed on the M1L being on the barrel where does the carb go? will I have to cut the panel?

Would be interesting to hear how Smallyshane's one is going too, his spec is the sort of thing I was aiming for, will be interesting to know what the HP difference is compared with reed.

[tony]

carb goes in standard position.

[adspeed]

Parma, M1L, Falc, all pucka pal. Casings need work increasing in the same order, but so does the power ;D

I run the Parma top dollar mate, building a Falc but yet to see the results......all come complete with maifold for carb in std position...

[Juan]

I reckon the M1 might be the stealth choice. Or A Parma rotary.

Check back on the YouTube thread for the standard looking red 50 Special running the M1.

Want it! ;D

[sugarlump]

JB tunings RB demonstrator makes 30bhp on it's conservative dyno. You'd need a hell of a motor to scare that (like the SS90 of the lad who works there putting out 30bhp too!!!!!!!!!!).

Hope you got deep pockets mate ;D ;D ;D

I'm (only ) rocking 14bhp and the front drum scares the shit out of me so if your looking for more i'd budget for disc forks too.

[adspeed]

Not to diss JB tuning, the 30hp is great but it is reasonably easy with say a TS1 to do that, but the power band narrows to near unusable. For instance SL ya Malossi could be easily taken to more HP but the band would look like it was squeezed, peakier than a peaky thing.

Many years ago Jap bikes had 12 or more gears cos they squeezed the horses out and reduced the power band to zilch......

Is that boring? sorry guys the Cobras going down....a bit like the Parma lol ;D

Anyway that Malossi took on good TS1's on on a standing start. Up till about 70mph when it lost the legs.......so I think your desired BHP will be spot on!

[sugarlump]

I'm happy as feck with the malossi, riding like an old woman is my problem ;D

[adspeed]

Just hang off the seat a bit, makes ya look faster ;D

[ozzy]

if your looking to not spend mental money, why not save a few by using static ignition,the vairiatronic is only really going to pick up some bottom/mid range.. then spend money where it counts; M1l, a seigorni race pipe, it should get you close to 20hp... falc would probably be completely impractical for the road, you'd be rebulding every 5 minutes and by the time you'd got the kit, specifc crank, specific pipe, maaahhhooosiv carb, specific clutch, etc, it'd cost you thousands... at least you'd make it to work and back on the m1l and it'd be margonally cheaper..... margonally...

[breezer]

Yep, if you can keep up with TS's & RB's up to 70mph on a smallie they are going to be shitting themselves.

Even if they eventually pull away they're still going to be questioning their masculinity for a week or so ;D

[ozzy]

Jun 27, 2008 22:00:10 GMT ozzy said:

if your looking to not spend mental money, why not save a few by using static ignition,the vairiatronic is only really going to pick up some bottom/mid range.. then spend money where it counts; M1l, a seigorni race pipe, it should get you close to 20hp... falc would probably be completely impractical for the road, you'd be rebulding every 5 minutes and by the time you'd got the kit, specifc crank, specific pipe, maaahhhooosiv carb, specific clutch, etc, it'd cost you thousands... at least you'd make it to work and back on the m1l and it'd be margonally cheaper..... margonally...

i just wanted to say that my 'rebuilding falc every 5mins comment', was not to say that falc stuff isn't bomb proof... i reckon it probably is.. their crank has massive 88mm webs and the whole tune makes its power lower down the rev range than then m1lr.... it was just based on the idea that falc/m1lr's can make over 25hp and surely thats gonna be tougher on the rest of your transmition than the 18-20hp of an m1l?

o

[soosh]

I managed a 16.4 sec on the 1/4 mile using a rotary setup on a malossi kit and it jumping out of gear still.No out of the box TS1 will do that and with a more modern pipe than i had,you will certainly make them old men in the LCGB think.It will last longer than an RB aswel.