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Post by MiNiKiN on Jan 10, 2008 18:12:54 GMT
will, i read a book meanwhile, it said by fitting a "internal combustion engine" to a carriage you wouldn't need horses any more. I think I gonna try that - thrilling what all these advanced technologies can do, nowadays. no offence mate, but the knowledge you refer to (NK-book and so called expert HB) is outdated as well as outperformed. I just say the gases in your system can't be arsed to go round these tight corners at speeds up to 200mph. Nevertheless keep the spirit and let us know how it works. Cheers M
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Post by soosh on Jan 10, 2008 19:24:59 GMT
Knowledge,you are slightly resticted on inlet port but as long as you leave about 1mm each side of the sealing pad,you will be fine and its possible to use 30mm carb.I know its a bit off hassle then getting correct timings but the Wan Kerr manual helped me and a call to Taffers and i got Terry`s old race timings and problem sorted.
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Post by hank on Jan 10, 2008 19:48:35 GMT
but the Wan Kerr manual helped me and a call to Taffers and i got Terry`s old race timings and problem sorted. is he talking bout you Juan
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Post by Juan on Jan 10, 2008 20:13:54 GMT
;D No,uncle Norman.He's shorter and fatter with glasses and a better attitude.
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Post by knowledge on Jan 10, 2008 23:21:13 GMT
Knowledge,you are slightly resticted on inlet port but as long as you leave about 1mm each side of the sealing pad,you will be fine and its possible to use 30mm carb.I know its a bit off hassle then getting correct timings but the Wan Kerr manual helped me and a call to Taffers and i got Terry`s old race timings and problem sorted. My rotary file tells me it too late, but I thank-you for the clarification. Whilst I'd like to say that I'll do that next time, I already know that the next engine will feature a full circle crank. Next engine? What the hell am I talking about? I haven't got this one running yet (Tonight, I was mostly side-tracked by a PaV trailer bracket, so no progress to report)
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Post by knowledge on Jan 12, 2008 23:15:55 GMT
It runs.
We had it started about 10.50pm. Not too noisy at tick-over speed. I put it into first, but it was stalling once the clutch was let out. I really needed to give it some beans and drop the clutch, but it was late and my mate's kids were asleep nextdoor, so this will have to wait until the morning (by which time it will be raining).
OK, so it ain't running properly, but it started. We'll call that "progress".
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Post by knowledge on Jan 17, 2008 21:57:21 GMT
Hmmm, progress has been poor. The clutch dump at higher revs did not prove that we can get this scooter off the line. You can get it moving by double, treble, and even quadruple de-clutching, but you just can't get the clutch fully out without it stalling. It just feels hideously over geared. OK 23/60 is a bit high, but I can't even pull first gear, let alone 4th. I feel that we might have been better to have gone with the 22/63 option, but give me you opinions on the 23/60 choice (and try to avoid laughing too much) It might just be very under-powered. Will suggested that we take some of your advice and up the carb size to increase power. A Dell'orto VHST 26mm was fitted, but has made no difference. Other suggestions from you guys have been about the unusual intake, but I feel that the V-force reed already flows far more than the old Polini item, and I have seen these fitted to machines that do 80mph+. Anyway, no spark at the moment, so we have stopped development for a while (Will has A level exams this week as well). I can't think of an electrical problem that would cause the scooter to run well out-of-gear, but die once it is in-gear and the clutch is let out. Can you? Martin, the Humble pie eater
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Post by roo on Jan 18, 2008 1:54:47 GMT
sure you've got the shift cables connected properly(q)
you may be trying to start in 3rd or 4th... even with the 2.60:1 primary, you should have enough to pull 1st!!! afterall, that is SHORTER gearing than a standard primavera, and you can even pull away in 2nd on one of those!
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Post by knowledge on Jan 30, 2008 23:52:27 GMT
Thanks Roo, but your advice now means that I have over-eaten on humble pie.
OK, time for an update. After lots of exams (for Will) and DIY (for the missus), I finally returned to the PK today during a day off work.
I cured to electrical problem, which was related to the CDI box and fitted a new, longer throttle cable. This has helped no-end with the carb on, carb off of re-jetting. I'm back to the 24mm for the time being.
However, the most important change was, as Roo suspected, to swap the gear cables around. Bugger. How embarassing?
OK, the engine started fine, and this time it pulled away (in first, not fourth). I played around with the jetting and soon it was working well. It has an 53 idle jet, AV264 atomiser, 90 main jet and the needle has the clip in the top groove.
I removed the Vespa fuel tank and rigged up a small lawn-mower petrol tank at the back of the hole left by the Vespa tank. This, with an in-line tap and a long fuel line, made access to the carb quite easy. I used a little wooden seat made from MDF whilst out on my test rides.
My first impressions are that it is really easy to ride. I never really clears in first gear, but pop it into second and it pulls well as soon as the clutch is engaged and revs through the range with more torque than I anticipated. It feels very rideable, pulls all the gears and we seem to have got the primary ratio about right.
Will needs to get some miles on the scooter, as the bore is new, and then we will have to look at development.
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Post by adspeed on Jan 31, 2008 18:19:09 GMT
Would you not set off in 2nd with the cables reversed, presuming you kicked it off in neutral? I'd be worried if you couldn't pull away in second!
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Post by tony on Jan 31, 2008 18:46:01 GMT
i once put my gears in back to front and the bike went backwards ;D
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Post by knowledge on Jan 31, 2008 22:52:30 GMT
Would you not set off in 2nd with the cables reversed, presuming you kicked it off in neutral? I'd be worried if you couldn't pull away in second! No Adam, I managed to find a false neutral between 3rd and 4th that was big enough to fool me into thinking it was the real neutral. Will put the rest of the bike back together tonight and it is ready for some miles on Saturday morning.
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Post by unreliablesc on Feb 1, 2008 5:57:19 GMT
No Adam, I managed to find a false neutral between 3rd and 4th that was big enough to fool me into thinking it was the real neutral. quote] I did the same thing once, tried to take off in 4th with super rich jetting. didn't go very well...
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Post by adspeed on Feb 1, 2008 10:38:19 GMT
Would you not set off in 2nd with the cables reversed, presuming you kicked it off in neutral? I'd be worried if you couldn't pull away in second! No Adam, I managed to find a false neutral between 3rd and 4th that was big enough to fool me into thinking it was the real neutral. Will put the rest of the bike back together tonight and it is ready for some miles on Saturday morning. Sorry Martin what was I doing thinking you might actually have it in neutral when you kicked it over......I'm a right one aren't i......
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Post by tony on Mar 6, 2008 2:09:20 GMT
so is it still ok martin?
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Post by stella speed on Mar 9, 2008 22:44:26 GMT
ur avin a laugh its got more leaks than tesco, martin leech... more like martin leek lol
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Post by stusclues on Mar 27, 2008 15:43:25 GMT
So, after reading all of the third season of Days of our lives here I was waiting for the payoff....
Come on Martin what's the score??
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Post by knowledge on Mar 27, 2008 20:45:46 GMT
Stu,
Thanks for asking. I've been busy with other stuff, which has given Will the chance to get the barrel run-in. This is the last oversize we will get for this barrel, so I'm pleased that he has got a couple of hundred kilometres on the clock without a sieze or score.
The apparent carburettor problem turned out to be a bad earth on the pick-up box under the stator, and after we down jetted on the pilot jet, it felt soooooo much better.
The clutch still has a small amount of drag, but it pulls away strongly and makes power all the way into the interesting part of the rev range. I got to ride it on Sunday, but I didn't go too far as it was snowing hard. Will says that it pulls best in 4th gear, which is not always what you hear on a standard 'box on the tuned engine. It looks like we got the primary ratio correct as well.
The bike now needs to go for a test on the dyno so I can put some figures to this tune, but we are really pleased with the performance so far, considering that apart from the specially constructed reed manifold, the other components were bits we picked up along the way or bought off the shelf.
Martin
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