64 V90

[robd]

Have recently acquired this for a fantastic price from a club mate, whose had it in his loft for a few years. He got it off another club mate who had it lying around after taking it for payment for some work. It had been stripped and resprayed but not put back together and was still in boxes. It's filthy and picked up some scratches and bumps from being shifted about so much etc but prefer my scooters to look lived in. In fact this is mint in comparison lol. The engine isn't the original and some of the case bolts are missing so will pull it apart this week and see what's inside. This is my first smallframe except a very brief flirtation with a 50 special about 10 years ago so think I'll be battering the search function on here and probably asking lots of questions.

Spent an hour this morning loosely bolting stuff together to try and work out what's missing, have another box of stuff but that's carb & airbox, top end, exhaust, engine shrouds and 2 four stud wheels. Not sure how much of that I'll use, have bought a Quattrini M1LR and have spent the last two days on here and the web looking at cranks trying to decide what's best to go for. Not currently having an ignition etc I've got a blank canvas. Any recommendations?

[shaun]

Hi Robd, welcome
Straying from the Lambretta world for a while, it will be a fun trip

That is a very nice little scoot, and looks mostly there.
I would ask advice on the fit of the engine first before you go too mad though, as I am sure kitted non small door engines don't fit in a small door without some work, and possibly having to run with no side door.

Shaun.

[robd]

Hi Shaun, thanks. It's not the only non Lambretta project I've got on at the moment, on with this at the same time though it's a bigger job on account of the floor being rotten. Conicidentally it's the same year as the v90



I hadn't realised that there might be clearance issues, going to be a steep learning curve! Will it be a case of building the engine and then modifying the frame to suit or can I 'buy smart' now and minimise the issues?

[shaun]

Cool, I had a '67 lambro 550N on the road for 7 years, it was ace and I miss it,
But prices are getting silly now

You will have to wait for a more knowing person to pop in, but I have read on here that kitted engines have frame clearance issues, and I met an oirish guy in IOW last year, I say met, I was riding my Smallie and 3 scooters chased and run me off the road in a box manouvre to talk about smallies
One of them has a 90 Small door, and can't run with the panel.

[nick121170]

nice find
vespatronic with beedspeed loom
you will have to cut the carb inlet hole in the frame larger for clearance
oh yeah get some brakes ,you will need them

[robd]

After a year and a bit of faffing about, accumulating bits and trying to decide what I wanted to do with it have finally made a start on the engine. Have never built a vespa engine before and so jumping in at the deep end.

Will apologise in advance for waffling on and posting loads of pics but if they're not in one place I'll end up losing the pics and forgetting what I did.

Spec is:

Parmakit w-force 144

BGM 51/105 full circle crank

38mm Keihin Airstriker

BSG 5 plate clutch

On shopping list is Big Bertha pipe, Faio or BSG gear selector, sip clutch cover and a gear cluster (not decided which one yet, any recommendations?). Hopefully have someone coming to buy an abandoned project next week so I can get an order in.

Was going to buy some LML cases from scooter center but spending on this was getting out of control so decided to stick with existing cases and buy an adaptor sleeve to use an ETS roller bearing. Splitting the cases in the first place was a bit of a mare so would rather have a needle roller than a conversion ball bearing.

Bit dear for a bit of turned aluminium...

 

Went in the freezer overnight and with the case hot enough to boil spit went in without too much drama. Was a bit cross with myself as marked the upper edge slightly due to a bit of surface rust on the drift I was using. Should've noticed but was itching to get going, won't cause any issues though. Wanted to do this ahead of machining cases as if did all that and then cracked them fitting this sleeve I'd have been gutted.

Need to get cases to machine shop now to have crank well diameter increased to clear webs on BGM crank and gasket face extended so there's room for the packer plate. I decided to go for the 97mm rod w-force kit and use a packer as there won't be as much material need removing from crankcase mouth. Casing should retain more strength around the cylinder studs. Should only need approx. 1.5mm taking out of the mouth to a depth of 12mm as opposed 3.5mm to a depth of 20mm. Does mean though that the only part of the spigot in the actual casing is the lower very thin part (spigot is stepped) and so will be dowelling the packer to the casings to make sure barrel centralises without stressing lower part.

Line shows where packer plate goes to

  

Packer plate marked up. When I get cases back, will dowel plate to cases and then take them back to be bored with the packer in place

 

[tzsteve]

ETS crank is a wise move and stoffis.com are the cheapest

[robd]

Hi Steve, cheers for the tip but wanted full circle as kit is direct intake and have already bought BGM crank. 

Next up was the clutch. I bought this about a year ago and as it doesn't come with primaries bought a set of CIF 27/69 from scooter center. I wanted a set of DRT ones but didn't want to spend out on a set with a fancy basket only to remove it.

I split the basket off the CIF gear and kept my eyes out for a set of DRT springs at I thought they might be better quality. Roll forwards a year and Daz on here sorted me out with a set and some other bits I was after. When I went round to pick the stuff up he very kindly gave me a set of very low mileage DRT primaries.

On close inspection aside from the shape of the windows holding the springs they look identical. The windows in the DRT gear are also slightly longer. This turned out to be important.

Tried to assemble the clutch on the DRT gear but the springs were too big in diameter for the top and bottom parts to come together. I tried fitting the springs from the CIF set to the DRT gear but still couldn't assemble it as the windows in the DRT gear are slightly longer and so the springs wouldn't fit into the machined recesses. I wasn't about to take the dremel to the clutch and so it was back to plan A and fitted the CIF springs back to the CIF gear and it slotted together a treat. Frustrating but all too common an experience when it comes to scooter parts it seems. Fingers crossed that the CIF gears are up to the job. My suspicion is that there is one place knocking out primaries and then companies like DRT buy them in and fit their own baskets to sell on.  

[robd]

Cases are at the machine shop, hopefully will be back next week.

Made a start on the forks. Picked up a front end from an et4 on ebay for £25 a few months ago. Bit crusty but after cleaning them up and grinding off the unwanted bracket they're rust free and look ok. Will leave the disc assembly on for now to make alignment easier for welding on the column adaptor.

[robd]

Engine cases came back from machine shop, light facing of gasket area and extending it to clear packer. Spigot hole opened up to suit stepped spigot on barrel and crank well opened up to clear bigger webs on BGM crank. Had to remove a bit more material with needle files on flywheel case lip to clear transfers on barrel. Started roughing out transfers but have been waiting for carbide burrs that have turned up in today's post. Need to crank on with dremel now but too flippin hot out at the moment...

[robd]

Not a lot of progress due to school holidays but have roughed out transfers and flattened and dowelled the packer plate. Just got to match the two together and plate to barrel and finish transfers and then make some plastic fake bearings to look at port timings

[tzsteve]

i dowled the case on my scoot and when i was doing some work at a later date the dowel dropped into the engine, loctite on the dowels in the case would have prevented me having to remove the engine from the frame to retreave the dowel

[robd]

Thanks for the tip Steve, I'd remembered reading your post about that and have put them in with 603 bearing retainer.

[tzsteve]

smart move, learn by others cock-ups

[henri]

no point askin the questions if ya dont listen to answers ,reckon weve got a "live" one here , eh tz .
lookin good so far , 1 thing right transfer/clutch side looks like its got a bit of a bulge in it at top , to be perfectionist theve got to match in size/area each side . this is were it gets nervous as theres different thickness of cases each side . H

[robd]

You're right Henri, have gone as far as I dare on that side but kept profile of the original. The cases aren't welded but there's a cautionary layer of JBWeld on the outside just in case I break through.

I think (read am hoping lol) that the <1cc difference between the two won't make an awful lot of difference, you lose some of the charge down the bearing passage on the opposite side anyway.

[tzsteve]

it will all work out in the end he`s off to a good start with some nice parts to play with and i reckon he`s got more idea than a lot of people who never have a go.

a vespa is like a bowl of minestorne you never know what your going to get untill it`s finished

[henri]

its a compromise ,like all tuning , some rough out the thinner side (clutch) an then cut fly side to match ,i'm not so sure it makes much difference really.the important areas to match 100% are the transfers in barrel, openings in my opinion .at spigot face the areas an in bore areas an heights , so long as cases arent blocking or have a step one side they should flow pretty evenly . H

[robd]

Transfers done, photo makes them look rough in places and odd shaped but smooth to the touch and match the base gasket so they'll do for me. Lots of cleaning away of swarf and knocking old bearings out next...

[sfcoaster]

This is a great project and all the photos are really helpful.